Thanks for to both Lisa and Jody for this. It’s funny, I am not the core audience for either of you - being a partnered 40-something parent of a young child - and I don’t want to insert my experiences into the conversation too much when I know that every childless person gets plenty of that already. But I’ve seen in my own life how much we all need to be working on building strong community and broadening who we think of as the family that we share mutual support and care with. In part I also want to make sure that I am doing that for the people in my life who don’t have the nuclear family; in part, I want that for myself because I don’t want any of our worlds to narrow down that much.
Sarah, I agree with Jody that I’m so glad you’re here! In the context of The Auntie Bulletin, I am certainly not interested in trying to make a space for childless or childfree people to speak at the expense of parents — really a main goal of this newsletter is for parents and non-parents to be in conversation and support of one another, so you absolutely belong!
Thank you Sarah. I agree that we ALL need this and, speaking as a childless woman, we also need parents like you who are awake to that. I would be very happy if the concept of Alterkin were to spread to other groups - none of it is 'new' - it's all open source human code!
Great interview with JODY DAY. I love the idea of the ALTERKIN group. My great niece and I have always been close. We're very similar in personality and values. She and I had the "when I'm really old" conversation a couple of years ago. She has copies of our wills and she knows our wishes for end of life. To have someone like that in my life is a blessing. That being said, I resonated with everything Jody has to say about ALTERKIN -- that is a community building exercise where I can see putting my service energies. Thanks for an inspirational interview, filled with enough information to create "action steps."
Lisa, I don’t have a lot of family, but this great niece sure makes up for that. We love each other dearly and I feel incredibly blessed. Without her, not sure what I would do — though I do like the idea of small communities of women adopting each other and being there to do what family often does during one’s last days. Big hugs.
Thanks Stephanie. I have a niece-by-love-not-blood that I'm very close to, but she lives in England and I'm in Ireland, and proximity is key to community... I really hope that as I am able to share more about the principles and learnings from my Alterkin pilot study as the year unfolds (confidentiality is key), it will inspire others to do something similar. One of the biggest issues I hear is "but I'm not going to be living here when I'm old" and using that as a way not to start building community locally... but I think it's like a muscle, the more you ease into building community, the more natural it becomes to always be doing it. I realise I've been doing it, one way or another, all my life--and almost none of them are part of my life anymore--but my life is so much richer for having been a part of them. I'm using everything I've learned about what works (and what doesn't) for Alterkin and I can't wait to see how it unfolds... xx
Jody Day, I am your faithful student in this regard -- I want to learn everything I can about community building . The idea of grass-roots sowing and growing is very appealing. Thank you for the good work you do in the world. We can all use a light to help us find that sense of elusive belonging that our souls crave. In love and kindness -- I can't wait to see how the ALTERKIN project unfolds! Big hugs.
Would be very interested to learn more about Project Alterkin. I googled it and not a lot of info. It sounds like a group of people who text each other for mutual aid, but…do y’all hang out otherwise? I understand the necessity of “doing inconvenient things with/for inconvenient people at inconvenient times” but is there any fun in these groups? Is mutual obligation enough to keep the group together?
Heya vita! There’s not much information yet because it’s totally in the pilot stage for Jody — she’s just experimenting with it in her own community — and I think she’s hoping not to have to be in charge of it, you know? Although I believe she is planning to write more about it and offer more ideas for structure down the road, so that would be one good reason to subscribe to her newsletter!
At this point it’s more of a germ of an idea that those of us are interested (I definitely am) will need to experiment our way into.
And I think you’re right that it would absolutely need to be a fun and joyful community in order to work. My experience is that giving and receiving mutual aid can often be in itself joyful, but I think there would also need to be like regular dinners and things. This would also be a much better way to find out about one another’s needs than hoping that we will just text each other if we have an ask, because so few of us are good at asking for help. But if we see each other regularly (at fun things!) we find out about the needs in one another’s lives.
Due to confidentiality, there's not a lot I can share about the project at the moment - it's just a tiny pilot study of mine in a rural Irish community! However, I will be sharing the principles I learn from it, and also interviews/resources with other childless/free women around the world doing similar/different projects.
And yes, 'meeting up' is a very important part of Alterkin. The aim is that we become part of the fabric of each other's local lives -- so there will be joyful times and hard times--just like in a family.
And there is joy and fun to be had too in helping others out with their gardening projects, their life admin, their daily lives -- it can be a powerful way to build intimacy and connection and laughter too. All of which can be fuel when the shit hits the fan...
"I read this book in July 2023. It was a compelling page-turner for me because it forensically referenced and laid bare the reasons behind the state of caring today.
Plus, I wanted to discover potential solutions that could enable us to be seen, valued, and embraced, not marginalised in society.
I encourage you to read it for yourself, whether you’re a Carer or not. A key read for me was ‘Chapter 4 On Family: Wise Women and the Practice of Kinning.’"
FYI Several community projects are underway in different countries, in different states of evolution.
I read it all in one long sitting - I had to get through all the enraging bits (history, stereotypes, societal norming! etc). You're very welcome. Let me know what you think.
The community idea is wonderful. We all need this. For a long time I thought about creating a tiny house community of elders but I'm not sure how many friends I can get to join me. But building a framework for looking after each other makes so much sense.
You're right, we all need this! It's weird how deskilled so many of us feel about it, isn't it? I really hope that as I start to share more about the framework I'm creating (Alterkin) and begin to share interviews with other childless/free women around the world who have done/are doing similar/different versions of it, we can all learn from each other. The very first step is to start asking others who LIVE NEAR you, whether it's a conversation they'd be interested in having... They don't have to be friends; this isn't about friendship, it's about community and they are very different beasts.
I am excited to hear more about Alterkin. I recently joined a Unitarian group that is mostly older people and they are starting to navigate this. I feel called to focus on the lived environment side of this (housing solutions, decluttering etc.) and the legal and financial details. Sharing knowledge is so important, I am so glad you are doing that!
Hi Lisa, thanks for sharing Jody's interview here - I've just subscribed.
Dearest Jody (Big Sis), you already know I'm walking alongside you in solidarity AND aligned with your views on Alterkin, intergenerational community building. You've laid out your journey, and the red threads that weave through beautifully - a VERY compelling read and manifesto!
Lisa, I'm not familiar with your articles/work...yet! May I offer that we need to think about Alterkin-ing and community support, not just 'early for ourselves' but for our friends/family now, an in turn get clear on what actions or role we will/will not do.
I'm a childless woman who intentionally chose to support my parents, resigning from my full-time 'big' job to start caring for them, aged 43, here in the UK. Not everyone feels they have a choice/option, and some carers I've spoken to feel labelled by their family as 'the obvious one to care for parents/elders'. Choice is important. As Jody says, we need to raise 'conscious awareness' - my point is that we need to do this early, and asap - especially given the changes to welfare, public spending and delayed social care reforms (UK).
FYI Research by the Centre for Care on the likelihood of providing care in the UK found that women have a higher chance of becoming a carer than men (70% vs 60%). By the time they are aged 46, half of women have been a carer. Men have the same 50:50 chance by age 57 – eleven years later. (I shared this on Intl Women's Day)
Victoria, thank you so much for subscribing! I really agree that we need to be thinking about this for our loved ones now.
In fact, I’ll be writing about this exact issue next week. I have some beloved elders for whom this is very much on my mind right now, and I am hoping that they will accept some support for me in the coming years.
And, I do this in part in the hopes that the universe will recognize that I may need the same thing someday. ❤️
I'm extra-glad we're connected! I'll look forward to reading your next article.
If I, or the Carer Mentor publication portal / community network can help let me know.
I've just updated the Giving/Receiving Care Anthology in Carer Mentor where you can find insights from the experiences of others who started the conversations around care support.
Oooooh, Victoria, I would love to take you up on that! I’m going to nose around your resources today and then I will reach out. Do you have contact information on the website?
Best way is to DM me. Alongside Carer Mentor writing, I'm still a full-time 24/7 carer and I have a small but active Mentoring business. So live-time is precious & rare, BUT having said that I'm a fast typer ;-)
There's a LOT on Carer Mentor (over 200 articles, 5 Anthologies and several indexes that include directories to other publications) It's a literal hub of resources AND portal others.
Have a look around the homepage and iCARE Stack. Free subscribers can DM me directly. Let's see how we go from there, Lisa!
Thinking about eldering IS also thinking about caring - for ourselves, for others; no one is going to sort this out for us, it's up to us to work out how to do it for each other, and to support each other as we do it. Caring, like mothering, was never meant to be a solo endeavour...
What a beautiful and sensitive post about approaching old age without children of your own to take care of you. Jody seems quite the woman - and I love her selfie! Will share this with a couple of cousins who are in this situation.
Well thank you Siobahn! Thank you for appreciating the interview and I really hope my work speaks to your cousins -- we are a large and growing cohort and it really helps when we find each other xx
"Community is built by doing inconvenient things with inconvenient people at inconvenient times.” It’s not necessarily easy, and it's not necessarily fun. It's not about having a big gang of friends. It's slow, human-paced relationship-building. There are no shortcuts.
Feeling this deeply as a childfree woman trying to organize an emergency plan among my (mostly) elderly neighbors in light of recent fires. I've barely begun and I'm already tired and annoyed, asking myself why I thought this was a good idea. It matters though! I know it does. We need people to look after us and to look after people. We are not meant to face life's mounting challenges alone. Thank you for the reminder that community building is not supposed to be easy. What an inspiring read.
Heather, what a lovely thing to do for your community. Are you doing this on your own on behalf of the elders in your community? If so, that sounds like a lot of work! And heck yes it matters. Thank you for what you are doing to make the world suck a little less.
A wonderful interview share! Thank you, Lisa and Jody. Your vision of interconnected support networks is deeply inspiring, offering a hopeful model of reciprocity and compassion in daily life. It's so great to be having these 'croning' conversations with kindred spirits. In a couple of years time I hope to set up or join a Crone group of some kind, myself. Together, we rise! 💜
Thank you so much for reading, Deborah! I’m thinking about trying to set up an ALTERKIN group in my area, and I would love to be talking with others who are setting up similar groups as we go along.
Talk to me Lisa! Happy to help you frame your thinking about how to get going with your own Alterkin group - I see a loosely federated hub of them all over the world, in time xx
Thanks for to both Lisa and Jody for this. It’s funny, I am not the core audience for either of you - being a partnered 40-something parent of a young child - and I don’t want to insert my experiences into the conversation too much when I know that every childless person gets plenty of that already. But I’ve seen in my own life how much we all need to be working on building strong community and broadening who we think of as the family that we share mutual support and care with. In part I also want to make sure that I am doing that for the people in my life who don’t have the nuclear family; in part, I want that for myself because I don’t want any of our worlds to narrow down that much.
Sarah, I agree with Jody that I’m so glad you’re here! In the context of The Auntie Bulletin, I am certainly not interested in trying to make a space for childless or childfree people to speak at the expense of parents — really a main goal of this newsletter is for parents and non-parents to be in conversation and support of one another, so you absolutely belong!
Thank you Sarah. I agree that we ALL need this and, speaking as a childless woman, we also need parents like you who are awake to that. I would be very happy if the concept of Alterkin were to spread to other groups - none of it is 'new' - it's all open source human code!
Great interview with JODY DAY. I love the idea of the ALTERKIN group. My great niece and I have always been close. We're very similar in personality and values. She and I had the "when I'm really old" conversation a couple of years ago. She has copies of our wills and she knows our wishes for end of life. To have someone like that in my life is a blessing. That being said, I resonated with everything Jody has to say about ALTERKIN -- that is a community building exercise where I can see putting my service energies. Thanks for an inspirational interview, filled with enough information to create "action steps."
Your relationship with your niece is like living the dream, Stephanie! I hope we all have a relationship like that as we age!
Lisa, I don’t have a lot of family, but this great niece sure makes up for that. We love each other dearly and I feel incredibly blessed. Without her, not sure what I would do — though I do like the idea of small communities of women adopting each other and being there to do what family often does during one’s last days. Big hugs.
I am just so freaking happy for you — and her! ❤️
Thanks Stephanie. I have a niece-by-love-not-blood that I'm very close to, but she lives in England and I'm in Ireland, and proximity is key to community... I really hope that as I am able to share more about the principles and learnings from my Alterkin pilot study as the year unfolds (confidentiality is key), it will inspire others to do something similar. One of the biggest issues I hear is "but I'm not going to be living here when I'm old" and using that as a way not to start building community locally... but I think it's like a muscle, the more you ease into building community, the more natural it becomes to always be doing it. I realise I've been doing it, one way or another, all my life--and almost none of them are part of my life anymore--but my life is so much richer for having been a part of them. I'm using everything I've learned about what works (and what doesn't) for Alterkin and I can't wait to see how it unfolds... xx
Jody Day, I am your faithful student in this regard -- I want to learn everything I can about community building . The idea of grass-roots sowing and growing is very appealing. Thank you for the good work you do in the world. We can all use a light to help us find that sense of elusive belonging that our souls crave. In love and kindness -- I can't wait to see how the ALTERKIN project unfolds! Big hugs.
Would be very interested to learn more about Project Alterkin. I googled it and not a lot of info. It sounds like a group of people who text each other for mutual aid, but…do y’all hang out otherwise? I understand the necessity of “doing inconvenient things with/for inconvenient people at inconvenient times” but is there any fun in these groups? Is mutual obligation enough to keep the group together?
Heya vita! There’s not much information yet because it’s totally in the pilot stage for Jody — she’s just experimenting with it in her own community — and I think she’s hoping not to have to be in charge of it, you know? Although I believe she is planning to write more about it and offer more ideas for structure down the road, so that would be one good reason to subscribe to her newsletter!
At this point it’s more of a germ of an idea that those of us are interested (I definitely am) will need to experiment our way into.
And I think you’re right that it would absolutely need to be a fun and joyful community in order to work. My experience is that giving and receiving mutual aid can often be in itself joyful, but I think there would also need to be like regular dinners and things. This would also be a much better way to find out about one another’s needs than hoping that we will just text each other if we have an ask, because so few of us are good at asking for help. But if we see each other regularly (at fun things!) we find out about the needs in one another’s lives.
Hi Vita
Due to confidentiality, there's not a lot I can share about the project at the moment - it's just a tiny pilot study of mine in a rural Irish community! However, I will be sharing the principles I learn from it, and also interviews/resources with other childless/free women around the world doing similar/different projects.
And yes, 'meeting up' is a very important part of Alterkin. The aim is that we become part of the fabric of each other's local lives -- so there will be joyful times and hard times--just like in a family.
And there is joy and fun to be had too in helping others out with their gardening projects, their life admin, their daily lives -- it can be a powerful way to build intimacy and connection and laughter too. All of which can be fuel when the shit hits the fan...
I hope you'll stay tuned as the project involved.
Jdoy x
Jody, I love this point of the daily admin tasks of living are often joyful when we do them together!
@vitajexjexjex and @lisa Sibbett
Lisa - I hope you don't mind me sharing this link to an article I wrote about Emily Kenway's book (pub. April 27 2023) The Hidden Crisis of Caring.
https://www.carermentor.com/p/who-cares-the-hidden-crisis-of-caregiving?utm_source=publication-search
"I read this book in July 2023. It was a compelling page-turner for me because it forensically referenced and laid bare the reasons behind the state of caring today.
Plus, I wanted to discover potential solutions that could enable us to be seen, valued, and embraced, not marginalised in society.
I encourage you to read it for yourself, whether you’re a Carer or not. A key read for me was ‘Chapter 4 On Family: Wise Women and the Practice of Kinning.’"
FYI Several community projects are underway in different countries, in different states of evolution.
Victoria, thank you so much. This book is going straight onto my reading list.
I read it all in one long sitting - I had to get through all the enraging bits (history, stereotypes, societal norming! etc). You're very welcome. Let me know what you think.
The community idea is wonderful. We all need this. For a long time I thought about creating a tiny house community of elders but I'm not sure how many friends I can get to join me. But building a framework for looking after each other makes so much sense.
Oh Deirdre, I hope you can do it! I have the same kind of dream. May it be so!
You're right, we all need this! It's weird how deskilled so many of us feel about it, isn't it? I really hope that as I start to share more about the framework I'm creating (Alterkin) and begin to share interviews with other childless/free women around the world who have done/are doing similar/different versions of it, we can all learn from each other. The very first step is to start asking others who LIVE NEAR you, whether it's a conversation they'd be interested in having... They don't have to be friends; this isn't about friendship, it's about community and they are very different beasts.
I am excited to hear more about Alterkin. I recently joined a Unitarian group that is mostly older people and they are starting to navigate this. I feel called to focus on the lived environment side of this (housing solutions, decluttering etc.) and the legal and financial details. Sharing knowledge is so important, I am so glad you are doing that!
Hi Lisa, thanks for sharing Jody's interview here - I've just subscribed.
Dearest Jody (Big Sis), you already know I'm walking alongside you in solidarity AND aligned with your views on Alterkin, intergenerational community building. You've laid out your journey, and the red threads that weave through beautifully - a VERY compelling read and manifesto!
Lisa, I'm not familiar with your articles/work...yet! May I offer that we need to think about Alterkin-ing and community support, not just 'early for ourselves' but for our friends/family now, an in turn get clear on what actions or role we will/will not do.
I'm a childless woman who intentionally chose to support my parents, resigning from my full-time 'big' job to start caring for them, aged 43, here in the UK. Not everyone feels they have a choice/option, and some carers I've spoken to feel labelled by their family as 'the obvious one to care for parents/elders'. Choice is important. As Jody says, we need to raise 'conscious awareness' - my point is that we need to do this early, and asap - especially given the changes to welfare, public spending and delayed social care reforms (UK).
FYI Research by the Centre for Care on the likelihood of providing care in the UK found that women have a higher chance of becoming a carer than men (70% vs 60%). By the time they are aged 46, half of women have been a carer. Men have the same 50:50 chance by age 57 – eleven years later. (I shared this on Intl Women's Day)
Victoria, thank you so much for subscribing! I really agree that we need to be thinking about this for our loved ones now.
In fact, I’ll be writing about this exact issue next week. I have some beloved elders for whom this is very much on my mind right now, and I am hoping that they will accept some support for me in the coming years.
And, I do this in part in the hopes that the universe will recognize that I may need the same thing someday. ❤️
I'm extra-glad we're connected! I'll look forward to reading your next article.
If I, or the Carer Mentor publication portal / community network can help let me know.
I've just updated the Giving/Receiving Care Anthology in Carer Mentor where you can find insights from the experiences of others who started the conversations around care support.
Oooooh, Victoria, I would love to take you up on that! I’m going to nose around your resources today and then I will reach out. Do you have contact information on the website?
Best way is to DM me. Alongside Carer Mentor writing, I'm still a full-time 24/7 carer and I have a small but active Mentoring business. So live-time is precious & rare, BUT having said that I'm a fast typer ;-)
There's a LOT on Carer Mentor (over 200 articles, 5 Anthologies and several indexes that include directories to other publications) It's a literal hub of resources AND portal others.
Have a look around the homepage and iCARE Stack. Free subscribers can DM me directly. Let's see how we go from there, Lisa!
Thinking about eldering IS also thinking about caring - for ourselves, for others; no one is going to sort this out for us, it's up to us to work out how to do it for each other, and to support each other as we do it. Caring, like mothering, was never meant to be a solo endeavour...
What a beautiful and sensitive post about approaching old age without children of your own to take care of you. Jody seems quite the woman - and I love her selfie! Will share this with a couple of cousins who are in this situation.
Well thank you Siobahn! Thank you for appreciating the interview and I really hope my work speaks to your cousins -- we are a large and growing cohort and it really helps when we find each other xx
"Community is built by doing inconvenient things with inconvenient people at inconvenient times.” It’s not necessarily easy, and it's not necessarily fun. It's not about having a big gang of friends. It's slow, human-paced relationship-building. There are no shortcuts.
Feeling this deeply as a childfree woman trying to organize an emergency plan among my (mostly) elderly neighbors in light of recent fires. I've barely begun and I'm already tired and annoyed, asking myself why I thought this was a good idea. It matters though! I know it does. We need people to look after us and to look after people. We are not meant to face life's mounting challenges alone. Thank you for the reminder that community building is not supposed to be easy. What an inspiring read.
Heather, what a lovely thing to do for your community. Are you doing this on your own on behalf of the elders in your community? If so, that sounds like a lot of work! And heck yes it matters. Thank you for what you are doing to make the world suck a little less.
This was so helpful and really has me reframing some of my mom’s planning that I’ve struggled with. Thank you both!
A wonderful interview share! Thank you, Lisa and Jody. Your vision of interconnected support networks is deeply inspiring, offering a hopeful model of reciprocity and compassion in daily life. It's so great to be having these 'croning' conversations with kindred spirits. In a couple of years time I hope to set up or join a Crone group of some kind, myself. Together, we rise! 💜
Thank you so much for reading, Deborah! I’m thinking about trying to set up an ALTERKIN group in my area, and I would love to be talking with others who are setting up similar groups as we go along.
Talk to me Lisa! Happy to help you frame your thinking about how to get going with your own Alterkin group - I see a loosely federated hub of them all over the world, in time xx